Spot for anything, BUT.....

[GrayRage]

....PS, EQ, SWG, SB or WOW! Hmmmmm wtf is left? :(


Oh yeah......Gray for PRESIDENT!

[Xondio]

You'd do better than Bush :D



I voted for Bush, and now I read he wants to take everyone who makes over 22,000$ (who gets paid by the hour) and make them salary, now their excuse is that those corporations will go ahead and hire more people and productivity would be increased.... however, we all know that American Corporations will just throw all that work to their employee's and get free overtime.

[GrayRage]

Yeah but he kicked Iraq's ass :)

OK, for pres this is what I am gonna do:

1. Institute "Fair Tax" http://www.fairtax.com - where taxes for federal gov are taken from a federal SALES tax instead of an income tax with a zillion loopholes. This would effectively abolish the IRS and make a bazillion CPAs and attorneys and judges have to find real jobs and would make doing our taxes alot easier. It would also make the super rich folks actually have to pay taxes :)

2. Legalize any victimless crime. (Drugs, gambling, prostition). I would tax and regulate the sale of all drugs and such tho (increasing gov income. I would put all the police assigned to enforcemnt of these retarded crimes into catching the fuckers who are raping, stealing and murdering other folks.

3. Revamp the criminal justice system. Examples:

a) Convicted killers are put to death. No exception. Accidetnal murders are not considered murder.

b) Rapests (sex criminals) are put to death.

c) Minor offenders like thieves, wife beaters...ect will be judged and 1st offenses will be met with public lashings (gods i want this job). 2nd offenders and more serious first offenders will receive jail time (explained later).

d) Prisons will be alot less populated because of the lashings (and killings of murderers and lack of victimless crimes), but for those who do find their way to prison, they will have to work hard labor 12 hours a day. Cleaning streets and parks ect. Anyone who fails to work will be put to the lash...continued non compliance will be put to death. Work for you room and board fuckers. If your in prison it's cause you are a parasite on society and really only alive cause we want to give you ONE more chance. No one serves two terms in prison. If u get out...and get busted doing something again, you are put to death.

4. Being a bum is illegal. If you are homeless, you will be arrested and put in a work camp. You will be paid minimum wage for 6 months (placed in an account they cannot get to until after the 6 months). Food and a roof will be given, but they must work in a similar fashion as prisoners. Non- compliance will be met with lashings. Continued non com;iance will be put to death. After 6 months, the bum is released and given access to the wages he/she earned the previous 6 months. It is hoped he /she will use those funds to find a place to live and get a job. If not, he she will be put to death :) ONly one stay at bum work camp per 5 year periods or your put to death.

Fact is, there is a ZILLION freagin people in our society....and ALOT of them are parasites. Why tip toe around them? WORK. Contribute to society and you will be fine. My system will punish those who try to leach off society and reward those who contribute with INCREASED freedoms and a better place to live. Less crime, cleaner cities, fairer taxes, more freedoms......

Make me dictator and it will all come to pass :)

[Rahne Sinclair]

If we're legalizing drugs, make people who are caught selling drugs to minors have death penalties as well. :)

And... get rid of this "If you make more than 22k you will be salaried" BS go away.

I mean I already am salaried, but that's still BS

[maniackiller]

Oh for fucks sake, don't even try to say the rich don't "REALLY" have to pay taxes, thats fucking bullshit.

And wtf, I don't hear shit about these fucking scum piece of shit making under $24,000 a year getting $400** a month for each damn kid they have. And while we're on the subject, those pieces of shits living in goverment runned apartments only having to pay like $50, they're a fucking drain on society. I would rather have bums in the street asking me for a cig than having those no good for nothing pieces of shit living free off the government.

**I never got any clarity on rather it was $400 a month or $400 a year for each kid, but from what I've been gathering it was $400 a month.. and also I took a little break from the news, did that pass yet?

[Lesa]

I love Penis! :cool:

[Xondio]

Originally posted by Lesa
I love Penis! :cool:


woo, you and my ex gf both! lol

[edit] don't mind my sig, it's not true! .... .... .... :D

[GrayRage]

IMHO Drugs should be treated like alcohol. However, add better warning labels describing EXACTLY what it does to u...addictive....makes u lazy...whatever. Even if they legalized pot, i could not do it cause it makes me lazy as hell and i would end up in the bum farm ;p

As for the 22k salary thing....i would let companies deal with their employess how they will. People don;t have to work for them....if they suck...make a union....or quit and join another company...or start your own. Making companies do shit...is aweful close to socialism for my taste.

About the rich not paying taxes....I can tell you from experince that the wealthy folks get away with ENORMOUS tax breaks. Fact is, I would pay ALOT more taxes if we went to a federal sales tax system...but i don;t fuckin care cause then i don;t have to add up all my ghey receipts.

BTW...ever wonder how much companies like GM pay in taxes?

Sales tax (let's say 10% on everything) is fair. Everyone pays the same percentage...whether u are buying a BMW or a chevy.

DO NOT QUESTION THE DICTATOR DAMMIT!

[Xondio]

no damnit, im not living around stupid stoned fucks my whole life, i'd sooner shoot them. Only alcohol should be legal, of course, drunks cause a shit load of problems too. :cool:

[GrayRage]

Oh, and about the freeloader fuckers who get money for free formthe government.....that's over :) Work or we send u to the middle east to fight, bitches.

OH!!!! I almost forgot!

- Licenses to have children - TO have a kid you will have to get a LIcense with the following requirements:

1. 2 years stable residence
2. 2 Years same job
3. 2 Years being with same person (at same residence)
4. Good credit history
5. Must take some kind of class on how not to raise your kid like an animal.

Violations will force abortion and subsequent lashing for first offense. Castration ect for second offense.

Oh and in case u cannot tell...I am far from pro life....there are to damn many people as it is :)

[GrayRage]

Like what? Killing folks while driving? See my post about killing folks ;p Oh...and who cares if they wanna do drugs....it does not hurt you or anyone else. Let em' do what they want. If they break the law...tho....they better not try to use the "I was not myself" BS....

Drive under the influence and kill someone....and yer goin down. That should stop that crap fast.

[Xondio]

lol, yeah that and being totally fucking retarded... speaking of that, there should be a law that a person can't be a complete fucking idiot, I could give examples and certain people but i'm afraid I don't have an entire lifetime or space on the forum to post it all :(

[maniackiller]

I agree with you on some things but I must say, the day you become pres is the day Canada > U.s.. Oh wait..

[Nexex]

Day Gray becomes pres is the day that USA invades Both Canada in Mexico, and wins in one week! United continent of North America

[GrayRage]

It would be very likely we would begin borging Canada and mexico (only for the slave labor) very shortly after i become dictator...errr president. And OMG....poor castro ;p

resistance is futile Canada!

[Xondio]

Originally posted by GrayRage
It would be very likely we would begin borging Canada and mexico (only for the slave labor) very shortly after i become dictator...errr president. And OMG....poor castro ;p

resistance is futile Canada!


I wasn't aware Canada *could* resist lol.... oh wait thats the French :rolleyes:

[AD Nnuk]

... taxes for federal gov are taken from a federal SALES tax instead of an income tax with a zillion loopholes.

We've got a little something like that in Canada called the GST (Goods & Services Tax) and, when it's implementation was being discussed, we got a sales pitch which included all that cool stuff about overall lower taxes.

End result?

There's a 7% Federal sales tax (the GST), personal income taxes haven't come down one iota and -- here's the kicker -- the GST proved to be such a cash cow that most Provinces (States in Canada) have implemented a PST (Provincial Sales Tax) of around 8%.

The idea looks real good on paper but in practice... Well.. One must keep in mind that people suck -- And groups of people (such as governments, for example) suck even more.

Legalize any victimless crime.

Hell yeah... Though I suspect you'd be assassinated before that ever became law.

While being a definate boost to the nation's economy in the form of increased tax revenues and lowered law enforcement expenses it would simply ruffle too many feathers.

Everyone -- from street pushers and pimps to cops and judges (as well as the various lobbyists and assorted mouthpieces for both sides) -- has their finger in the pie and none of 'em will remove it willingly.

As a sidenote.. We're finally decriminalizing marijuana in Canada. :cool:

>>> Various stuff about public floggings and the reinstatement of the guillotine <<<

In certain cases there is simply no question: The convict should simply be put down. Whackos like Manson come to mind.

But a blanket law for such things can't be done fairly.

If you came home one day to find me boinking Axxy [/wave Axxy] you'd likely go f'ing nuts -- Would those 7 slugs you pumped into my arse as I was running out of your house like a bat out of Hell be considered "accidental"? If not... Should you be hung for your crime even though you've got 20, 30, 40, etc years under your belt as an upstanding, law-abiding, tax-paying citizen without so much as a parking ticket on your record?

Incidentally.. Some of you folks reading this have no idea who I am or what I stand for so you're prolly thinking I'm some kind of peace&love renegade hippy. Kindly let me dispell that belief by informing you that I firmly believe most fuckwits (like 80% of the shaved chimps I'm forced to share my oxygen with) shoulda been drowned at birth.

But I digress... I do like the forced labor angle. I recall reading an article a couple of years ago about a Sheriff somewhere in Texas (I think it was Texas) who set-up a similar program with much success -- Not only did his program lower the county's expenses (ie: Low-cost labor instead of overpaid public workers) but the rate of repeat offenders dropped by a significant margin as well.

Being a bum is illegal. If you are homeless, you will be arrested and put in a work camp.

Ahem... Victimless crime. ;-)

However a voluntary program of that nature (meanial labor with a frozen paycheck) would likely help a lot of peeps in the longrun.

About the rich not paying taxes....I can tell you from experince that the wealthy folks get away with ENORMOUS tax breaks.

True... But most of 'em still end up generating more tax revenue (in terms of actual dollars if not as a percentage of earnings) than the guy who cleans the toilets at McD's (No offense, Nex. ;-)).

BTW...ever wonder how much companies like GM pay in taxes?

Corporate taxes are a different kettle of fish.

Even if GM had a 100% tax break they'd still generate millions of dollars in revenues for the government via the sale of their product as well as taxes paid by their employees, suppliers, the employees of their suppliers, etc.

And, finally, I'm not sure what a good credit history has to do with parenting children effectively but hey... If it means less humanoids polluting the gene pool I'm all for it.

Oh yeah... I almost forgot:

I wasn't aware Canada *could* resist lol

We "resisted" just fine every time y'all tried to start shit -- The last incident involved the torching of the White House. ;-)

oh wait thats the French

Not that I particularly like the French (they are, collectively, the most conceipted, rude and ignorant people on the face of the Earth... Right after Americans. ;-)) but while you're cracking jokes about their surrender in the War and their opposition to the Iraq invasion you might want to keep in mind that there wouldn't be a USA if they'd not have saved your ancestors' asses from the Brits when they were trying to gain independence.

Artfully Yours,

Nnuk
Master of the Arts
Artful Death Gallery (http://www.artfuldeath.com)

[Xondio]

Thats a double edged sword really, because if it wasn't for America, the entire world would be speaking german and fall under the Third Reich, and don't get me on where Canada would be without us, it's not even a real country, does Canada even bother with an army? :cool:

By the way, the only thing the French did was to keep the British fleet from coming over, and do you know why? because they wanted a piece of *our* colony, and they also were in a direct war already with the British. In WW2, we went through their territory to get their enemies out, and we did it so we could stop a dictator who wanted to take over the world, not because we wanted to start a great economy trade with France after.

Also, it's more of a fact that France surrenders in, *every war*. But why should Canada worry about a war, they hide behind the America they *hate*.

Secondly, I don't hate Canada (I do find most of them complete fucking idiots though [must be because they are an off-shoot of France], although alot of Canadians are cool as well), I really just hate Mexico, I'm getting tired of having Spanish on signs I read in the middle of fucking Oklahoma because we have every spic and their fucking entire family sneaking over here. Thats why Mexicans don't have an olympic team, because anyone who can run, jump, and swim are already over here. We need to take all mexicans, whether here legally or not, and send them back to Mexico. There are a few really cool mexicans, but for the most part, most of them need to go.


you also said

We "resisted" just fine every time y'all tried to start shit -- The last incident involved the torching of the White House. ;-)


in what, the 18th century? I don't think currently Canada could take a stand against a Mexican army, let alone an American one ;)

[GrayRage]

The idea looks real good on paper but in practice... Well.. One must keep in mind that people suck -- And groups of people (such as governments, for example) suck even more.

ONe word: corruption. The only reason canada (and the US for that matter) does not do a national sales tax (and get rid of income tax is corruption pure and simple. Parasite who LIVE off the difficulties of others like IRS, Tax Attorneys, Judges, tax accountants.....EXIST from the pathetic income tax system. If a federal sales tax came into being there would be ZERO reason for all of those people to have those jobs and THEY would SCREAM.

But why should we make our tax system miserable just to give free jobs to people? Hey, I got an idea, why not create a bunch of nasty zombie rats to plague us....so we can employ a bigger pest control force.....DOH? Fact is, creating or KEEPING a shit thing JUST to keep jobs for people SUCKS. The Income tax system is BOGUS and corrupt. It's complicated for no fucking reason but to creat loopholes for big corporations and wealthy people. And continues to exist because of THEM and all the parasites who would have to find a REAL job if they came up with a just tax system.

I mean what could be simpler then a straight percentage off the goods you buy? So simple. So easy. Why don;t we do it? Cause of corruption.

Hell yeah... Though I suspect you'd be assassinated before that ever became law.

While being a definate boost to the nation's economy in the form of increased tax revenues and lowered law enforcement expenses it would simply ruffle too many feathers.

Everyone -- from street pushers and pimps to cops and judges (as well as the various lobbyists and assorted mouthpieces for both sides) -- has their finger in the pie and none of 'em will remove it willingly.

Well, although ALOT of law enforcement does work on victimless crimes, they would not lose there jobs. There is alot of other stuff i would have them do. Terrosim...border patrol...simple neighborhood surveillance (catching real criminals in neighborhoods). The pimps and stree husslerers are not a problem and i doubt have a huge lobby.

My big fear is the physcho moral nuts who think their will should be forced on others. If they think gambling is wrong...it's wrong. If they think drugs are wrong...it's wrong. If they think we should not drink on Sunday cause its god's day...then by damn no alchohol will be sold on Sunday. Fuck these people though. I hate anyone who wants to push their morals on me. If they do not want to hire a prostitute, then don't....but why make it so some gimp who never get's pussy cannot hire one (Brenlain).....JK BREN! hehe. Anyhow, u are right, these are the nuts who stop things like that from happening.

If you came home one day to find me boinking Axxy [/wave Axxy] you'd likely go f'ing nuts -- Would those 7 slugs you pumped into my arse as I was running out of your house like a bat out of Hell be considered "accidental"? If not... Should you be hung for your crime even though you've got 20, 30, 40, etc years under your belt as an upstanding, law-abiding, tax-paying citizen without so much as a parking ticket on your record?

OOOOO forgot to add this one. Cheating on your spouse is death penalty. Better get a divorce first :) I hate people that cheat on their spouse. Think about it, what type of person would lie to the closest person in their life? What type of person would risk hurting the closest person in their life for some sex? A dick. Fact is, if u feel like cheating, u don;t really want to be with your spuse anyway....At the very least, I would make it so it's a mitigating circumstance for spousel murder...sorta like self defense :) There IS a victim in adultery.....and as such would be illegal in my world. GET A FUCKING DIVORCE LAMOS.

Ahem... Victimless crime. ;-)

However a voluntary program of that nature (meanial labor with a frozen paycheck) would likely help a lot of peeps in the longrun.

Nay, society is the victim here. Having bums on the streets is an eyesore. Their efforts at begging is an attack on those they beg from. I know this is a close one (u are right...its is borderline victimless), but i truly believe it would be good for society...and as dictator i would make it law.

True... But most of 'em still end up generating more tax revenue (in terms of actual dollars if not as a percentage of earnings) than the guy who cleans the toilets at McD's (No offense, Nex. ;-)).

Perhaps as an individual, but as a group, the poor and middle income pay the majority of the taxes in the US. By far.

And, finally, I'm not sure what a good credit history has to do with parenting children effectively but hey... If it means less humanoids polluting the gene pool I'm all for it

Shows a certain level of responsibility.....which one would think was important for those who will be parenting a child...teaching them and bringing them up in OUR world.

Not that I particularly like the French (they are, collectively, the most conceipted, rude and ignorant people on the face of the Earth... Right after Americans. ;-)) but while you're cracking jokes about their surrender in the War and their opposition to the Iraq invasion you might want to keep in mind that there wouldn't be a USA if they'd not have saved your ancestors' asses from the Brits when they were trying to gain independence.

IN all seriousness, i like being allied to the french and canda for that matter. Sure, they are annoying at times, but it's their opinion. If it ever came right down to it and we were actually attacked, I am certain the french would be 100% behind us. They just did not agree that it was legit to go into iraq.

They were/are wrong....but that's my opinion. As for canada, I would have to borg them for sure.

[GrayRage]

Secondly, I don't hate Canada (I do find most of them complete fucking idiots though

I went to canda for work a while back. I am sorry to say, that they are cleaner, nicer and overall more educated then our countrymen are :( Sucks...but as much as I love our country, we truly have alot of dickheads here.

I mean serious, who is not nervous EVERYTIME you turn around in the US that some asshole is not trying to take your money? It almost seems like EVERYONE is scamming in the US sometimes. Perhaps it's like that in canada too...i dunno.

Anyhow....when i become dictator...that shit will stop. I mean...is it worth public lashings to steal an EQ account? ;p Or labor camp? hehe. OR DEATH IF its your 3rd EQ ACCOUNT STOLEN?! I think not :)

[Xondio]

most countries are more educated than us :(



You said every asshole is trying to take your money in the US, but it's like that no matter where you go.

I went to Canada a couple years ago and I have to say I really didn't notice a difference, except that some of them speak French and that was it, everything else seemed the same. But it's not nicer nor cleaner than where I live... it depends on where you go and where you live.

[Rahne Sinclair]

Hey as long as you outlaw "Bluebie-ism" and make Anti's face the death penalty, I'll give Emperor "Palpatine" Grayrage a shot in office. ;)

(Edit: This thread was starting to make WAY too much sense and being FAR too productive, I had to muss it up a little)

:)

[GrayRage]

In all seriousness, tell me everyone has not noticed a scam or thief every damn day. Just look in your email. it seems like a HUGE number of folks are trying to take your shit at every turn. You know why? Cause they get away with it. And even if they get caught...nothing serious happens to em.

I am thinking the public lashing should be on live public access TV too :) The government could sell awesome TV spots on that for more cash!

OH! Did i forget to mention what I would o with all the extra cash revenue (and the less amount needed to spend on stupid crap like feeding prisoners)? Well here it is:

SPACE PROGRAM. I would put so much fuckin money into the space program it would make you sick. I seriously think we could make a faster then light speed space craft rather easily (and I do not buy into Einsteins bullshit that we cannot go faster then light).

Man would i funnel cash into that shit.

[Xondio]

Well, my theory is anything is possible, and heres why...

In 1700's they thought flying was impossible.

in 1800's they thought advanced weapons were impossible

in 1900's they thought if you went faster than 25mph you would die.


I believe we can achieve anything as long as we all pull together and do it. But as with humanity, the one thing we will never achieve is peace, it is in human blood to have strife, that is the one thing that will never end, unless a greater threat came, and that would have to be aliens (which I don't believe in).

[AD Nnuk]

... if it wasn't for America, the entire world would be speaking german and fall under the Third Reich...

Perhaps... Perhaps not.

I don't mean to minimize US involvement. Truly I don't. However presenting it as the US riding into Europe with guns a blazin', old glory flyin' high and an apple pie to throw at Hitler's face for the sole purpose of truth, freedom and blah blah blah is about as accurate as Creationists insisting that the world was created in under a week and the existance of dinosaurs is nothing but a ruse used by the scientific community to lead God's children into the arms of Satan.

Fact is that the US stood idly by for several years while countless people were tortured, maimed and slaughtered... Not even considering getting involved until it became quite clear that they were on the list of future conquests and they knew damn well they wouldn't have been able to go at it alone against the Reich.

[Note: I'm not saying whether it's right or wrong... Just tellin' it like it is/was.]

don't get me on where Canada would be without us

Actually... I am doing precisely that.

Enlighten me -- Where would we be?

The US and Canada -- with the exception of a few skirmishes which, incidentally, we won -- have had a symbiotic relationship since Day 1. It's been mutually beneficial for both countries and if you seriously believe otherwise I must respectfully suggest that you acquire your knowledge of world history from someplace other than South Park.

it's not even a real country

Perhaps it would serve you well to crack open a dictionary to look up the words "country" and "nation". :rolleyes:

does Canada even bother with an army?

We have an adequate military to protect our borders. Worse comes to worse... Our little non-country is part of the Commonwealth, the UN, etc -- It's not like we're a bunch of beaver-skin hat wearing mofos chewing on whale blubber while sitting in our igloos and waving our squirrel rifles.

Do we have an adequate force to invade another country? Nope -- Nor do most Canadians want one.

Secondly, I don't hate Canada (I do find most of them complete fucking idiots though [must be because they are an off-shoot of France]

Um... Canada was a British colony. ;)

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We "resisted" just fine every time y'all tried to start shit -- The last incident involved the torching of the White House. ;-)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



in what, the 18th century?

That particular example hailed from 1812.

I don't think currently Canada could take a stand against a Mexican army, let alone an American one

The world isn't a bunch of isolated pockets anymore, Xondio.

The US couldn't rally global backing to invade Iraq (a state which hardly ranks among the most popular) and lack the military juice to effectively take on a Korea (about as well regarded as Iraq).

Realistically speaking... If the US ever sets one hostile foot on Canadian soil they'll have most of the world breathing down their necks so fast that Vietnam would seem like a total victory by comparison.

Look.. I know I'm giving ya a bit of a hard time but come on, man -- You're sounding like those fuckwits that want to rename "French Fries" to "Freedom Fries". :D

Artfully Yours,

Nnuk
Master of the Arts
Artful Death Gallery (http://www.artfuldeath.com)

[AD Nnuk]

ONe word: corruption.

Indeed -- But "people suck" sounds more contemporary. ;)

The biggest problem -- in almost all areas of government in "democratic" societies -- is overmanagement. Just like your local municipality sends out 4 guys to fill one friggin pothole... State and Federal beaurocracies work in much the same way.

It's wrong. It makes no fiscal sense. It stinks of corruption so badly that my sinuses begin to smolder just thinking about it.

But it's the way things have always been, currently are and, most likely, will continue to be far beyond our lifespans.

Well, although ALOT of law enforcement does work on victimless crimes, they would not lose there jobs. There is alot of other stuff i would have them do.

It's not their "jobs" that most of 'em are worried about -- It's their fiefdoms and the insane amount of cash (and power) they generate.

OOOO forgot to add this one. Cheating on your spouse is death penalty.

Dunno about the death penalty... But I'd certainly be open to seeing some consequences for this particular offense.

I'm not a religious nut and, with the life I've led, I'm in no position to be preaching morals to people but...

>>> Think about it, what type of person would lie to the closest person in their life? What type of person would risk hurting the closest person in their life for some sex? <<<

... That's just plain ole common sense which, unfortunately, a growing number of people these days don't give a flying fuck about.

People suck.

Perhaps as an individual, but as a group, the poor and middle income pay the majority of the taxes in the US. By far.

/nods

But the way that middle-class folks pay their taxes is with the income they make working for the wealthy. Even if Bill Gates never pays a cent of taxes in his lifetime he'll still have generated millions -- nay... Billions -- of dollars of tax revenue.

I do understand what you're saying and I wholeheartedly agree. However having run businesses in both Canada (where we're taxed up the ying/yang) and the US (much lower taxes -- Business taxes, at least] I firmly believe that lower business tax puts a larger quantity of dollars into the public's coffers in the longrun.

Shows a certain level of responsibility.....which one would think was important for those who will be parenting a child...teaching them and bringing them up in OUR world.

I know a shitload of peeps with an R1 rating which should be immediately "fixed"... And I know more than a few R9s that make wonderful parents -- I'm all for licensing and I understand that certain guidelines would be required but each case would have to be looked at on an individual basis or we'll end up with a generation of ignorant bastards whose only saving grace is an ability to pay their Visa bill on time.

In closing.. I've just perused a little further down the thread and noticed a gem which bears repeating:

I went to Canada a couple years ago and I have to say I really didn't notice a difference

I don't mean to be argumentative, X, but that's gotta be one of the most ridiculous statements I've ever seen made in a semi-serious discussion -- And I've seen some real whoppers.

You can go into the absolute worse neighborhoods in Canada (Well.. I can only speak about Ontario and Quebec from personal experience) and you won't find a single dwelling with a protection cage enclosing the front porch/yard. Hell... I saw more graffiti and trash laying around in Saratoga Springs (NY) than I ever have in downtown Montreal.

And don't even get me started about crime rates and such or I'll be here all week. ;)

Artfully Yours,

Nnuk
Master of the Arts
Artful Death Gallery (http://www.artfuldeath.com)

[GrayRage]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
OOOO forgot to add this one. Cheating on your spouse is death penalty.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Dunno about the death penalty... But I'd certainly be open to seeing some consequences for this particular offense.

I'm not a religious nut and, with the life I've led, I'm in no position to be preaching morals to people but...

This has nothing to do with morals. There is a victim here. The person doing the adultering is doing something a bit extra evil because he/she is doing something he/she KNOWS could seriously hurt the person they are suppoed to be closest too. If you don't like em' anymore, get a divorce and fuck whoever you want. Perhaps this would not be a state santioned death penalty offense, but i think it would be justifiable homicide if a spouse caught you in the act....

perhaps public flogging by the state. Still, pretty dispicable. Would you trust someone who cheats on theri wife/husband? I wouldn't. If they would be willing to lie to their spouse, anyone else would be cake for them to deceive.

I know a shitload of peeps with an R1 rating which should be immediately "fixed"... And I know more than a few R9s that make wonderful parents -- I'm all for licensing and I understand that certain guidelines would be required but each case would have to be looked at on an individual basis or we'll end up with a generation of ignorant bastards whose only saving grace is an ability to pay their Visa bill on time

It's just one of several checks. Fact is, if you cannot pay your bills, how the fuck can u add more expenses to your life? Having kids if you cannot even pay your bills before having them is a recipe' for disaster IMHO.

Fact is, there are to many fuckin people as is. Not sure the exact stats, but our world population grows by quite a bit each year......ummmm...unless we get insterstellar flight soon, WTF are we gonna do? There IS limited space on Earth.....and the population is NOT gonna stop growing.

I went to Canada a couple years ago and I have to say I really didn't notice a difference

I flew from Newark to Ottawa. I work in Miami often. I can assure you, there is a considerable differnce. Folks in Miami are just plain mean. As a rule people are trying to stesal from you no matter what you do. Sure sure.....mebe not the old hold up robbery theft, but just go to a store and buy something......always a scam. Fact is, u gotta watch your ass in Miami...or lose it. In Ottawa it was alot diiferent. People were nice.

Found some nice people in Tennesee too tho....so mebe Miami just sucks :)

[Bradic]

It is hoped he /she will use those funds to find a place to live and get a job. If not, he she will be put to death ONly one stay at bum work camp per 5 year periods or your put to death.

Roflmao. Now there's a thought :D

[Xondio]

Originally posted by AD Nnuk
Perhaps... Perhaps not.

I don't mean to minimize US involvement. Truly I don't. However presenting it as the US riding into Europe with guns a blazin', old glory flyin' high and an apple pie to throw at Hitler's face for the sole purpose of truth, freedom and blah blah blah is about as accurate as Creationists insisting that the world was created in under a week and the existance of dinosaurs is nothing but a ruse used by the scientific community to lead God's children into the arms of Satan.

Fact is that the US stood idly by for several years while countless people were tortured, maimed and slaughtered... Not even considering getting involved until it became quite clear that they were on the list of future conquests and they knew damn well they wouldn't have been able to go at it alone against the Reich.




There is absolutely no way the war would have been won without the US, we were the pivotal turning point of the war. Obviously we did it on the eastern front with help, and we needed it as well. But we got little to no help on the pacific side.

and you said countless people were slaughtered and tortured... um modern day Iraq? and no one gave a shit except the US, and whenever we tried to go into there everyone said it was for oil. did you know we hardly get any of our oil from them.



Actually... I am doing precisely that.

Enlighten me -- Where would we be?

The US and Canada -- with the exception of a few skirmishes which, incidentally, we won -- have had a symbiotic relationship since Day 1. It's been mutually beneficial for both countries and if you seriously believe otherwise I must respectfully suggest that you acquire your knowledge of world history from someplace other than South Park.

Perhaps it would serve you well to crack open a dictionary to look up the words "country" and "nation". :rolleyes:



You would be part of the united states of germany.

Or, had we not been the border between mexico and you, you would be an off-branch of Mexico.

And when you say skirmish, your mistaking yourself with us actually putting force behind these.

and you benefit us how? besides hiding behind america?






We have an adequate military to protect our borders. Worse comes to worse... Our little non-country is part of the Commonwealth, the UN, etc -- It's not like we're a bunch of beaver-skin hat wearing mofos chewing on whale blubber while sitting in our igloos and waving our squirrel rifles.

Do we have an adequate force to invade another country? Nope -- Nor do most Canadians want one.



So we know who to count on if a war ever came.



Um... Canada was a British colony. ;)

Partly, and heres why

French explorer Champlain established the first settlement in 1604 on St. Croix Island in the Bay of Fundy near the St. Croix River, that is now part of the dividing line between Canada and the United States. Winter conditions were so brutal, survivors moved the colony across the Bay to a secluded valley, protected by mountains, with a basin fed by rivers. In 1605 they settled permanently at Port Royal, Acadia (now Annapolis Royal, Canada) and the Acadians or "Cajuns" began their American experience.

In spite of European Wars between France and England, court intrigues, trading the colony back and forth between nations, power struggles between Protestant and Catholic factions, years of bloody skirmishes between rival trading companies for control, raids by pirates, occupation by English troops and over a century of power struggles for control of the largely self-governed populace, the Acadians were noted, by French Governor Subercase, to be "the happiest people in the world."




That particular example hailed from 1812.


Point established, thanks. But just for the hell of it, how about a time-line?

The War of 1812 began on June 18, when President James Madison officially proclaimed the U.S. to be at war with Great Britain. Congress had voted for war on June 4 and June 8. The war, which caused great harm to the U.S. economy, came after a long period of troubled relations between the two countries, caused mainly by Britain's conflict with Napoleonic France. The British seized American ships, impressed seamen from them, some of whom were U.S. citizens, and attempted to keep U.S. ships from reaching French ports. The war was also the result of the influence of the so called War Hawks in Congress, Henry Clay and other westerners who wanted to acquire moreland by conquering Canada. Inronically, on June 23 Great Britain, not aware of the declaration of war, suspended the orders that had hampered U.S. shipping.

1812- The U.S. frigate Old Ironsides (Constitution) defeated the British ship Guerriere off Nova Scotia. The Constitution was commanded by Commodore Isaac Hull.

1812- In a naval engagement on Lake Erie, American forces under the commandof Lt. Jesse Duncan Elliott captured two British brigs, Detroit and Caledonia. Elliott was later forced to set fire to the Detroit.

1812- General Stephen Van Rensselaer was defeated in the battle of Queenstown Heights, Canada, on the Niagara frontier by the British and Indians. About 1000 U.S. troops were killed or wounded. British General Isaac Brock, captor of Detroit, was killed during the engagement.

1812- The U.S. frigate Constitution destroyed the British frigate Java in the fight off the coast of Brazil. Old Ironsides was under the commandof Commodore William Brainbridge.

1813- In the War of 1812 (1812-1814), Captain James Lawrence, commanding the U.S. frigate Hornet, captured the British ship Peacock.

1813- British forces surrendered York, Canada, now Toronto, to Americans commanded by Brig. Gen. Zebulon M. Pike, who was killed in the battle.

1813- Captain James Lawrence cried "Don't give up the ship" to his crew as he lay mortally wounded aboard the Chesapeake, which was subsequently defeated and captured by the British frigate Shannon in an engagement off the Massachusetts coast.

1813- A British naval victory off the coast of England was scored by the Pelican when it captured the American ship Argus, which had previously captured 27 British merchant vessels.

1813- The Battle of Lake Erie was a significant American naval victory. An improvised American fleet commanded by Oliver Hazard Perry decisively defeated the British after a bloody engagement. During the battle Perry's flagship Lawrence was crippled and he had to continue the fight from another ship. He returned to the Lawrence to accept the British surrender, then sent to General William Henry Harrison, commander in the west, the victory dispatch containing the words "We have met the enemy, and they are ours." The Americans gained control of Lake Erie, and the British were obliged to withdraw from Detroit, further strengthening the U.S. positioning in the Great Lakes.

1813- General Harrison defeated the British under General Henry A. Proctor at the Battle of the Thames, Ontario, Canada. Tecumseh, Shawnee Indian chief and ally of the British, was killed during the engagement. His death broke the Indian confederacy.

1814- Washington, D.C. was captured by British troops under General Robert Ross. The Capitol, White House, and other government buildings were set afire in retaliation for earlier burning of Canadian government buildings in York, Toronto, by U.S. troops.

1814- At the Battle of Lake Champlain a newly built U.S. fleet under Master-Commandant Thomas Macdonough annihilated a British squadron. This forced British General Sir George Prevost and his army to abandon their siege of the U.S. fort at Plattsburgh and to retreat to Canada on foot.

1814- The treaty of Ghent, ending the War of 1812, was signed on December 24 by representatives of the U.S. and Great Britain. They then set up the boundries between Canada and the US.


The world isn't a bunch of isolated pockets anymore, Xondio.


The US couldn't rally global backing to invade Iraq (a state which hardly ranks among the most popular) and lack the military juice to effectively take on a Korea (about as well regarded as Iraq).

Realistically speaking... If the US ever sets one hostile foot on Canadian soil they'll have most of the world breathing down their necks so fast that Vietnam would seem like a total victory by comparison.


Last time I checked the US is the one who originally backed and started the UN.

The same would be if mexico came into arizona, the un would back whoever is getting attacked, it's that simple.

However, in the case that America for some reason attacked Canada, and then the world came down on America, that would be the end for almost all countries, it is a domino effect. Our economy would turn to complete shit, and therefore affect other nations as well. Same thing with China, or Japan, say someone dropped an atomic bomb that whiped out at least 2/3rds of them, everyones economy would crumble.



Look.. I know I'm giving ya a bit of a hard time but come on, man -- You're sounding like those fuckwits that want to rename "French Fries" to "Freedom Fries". :D



I wouldn't go that far. But i'd rather sound like one them then sound like one of the dickheads who support iraq.

[Xondio]

Originally posted by AD Nnuk
[B] is about as accurate as Creationists insisting that the world was created in under a week


As to evolving from monkeys?

or that lifeforms were misteriously on earth out of no where, oh wait they just came with the planet right? lol

[GrayRage]

I am gonna like this board :D

[Xondio]

lol, just some friendly sparring is all, I enjoy it every once in a while really :cool:

[Vallidus]

Originally posted by AD Nnuk
-- It's not like we're a bunch of beaver-skin hat wearing mofos chewing on whale blubber while sitting in our igloos and waving our squirrel rifles.


Artfully Yours,

Nnuk
Master of the Arts
Artful Death Gallery (http://www.artfuldeath.com)

Holy hell, I think I just guffawed in rl

[AD Nnuk]

There is absolutely no way the war would have been won without the US, we were the pivotal turning point of the war.

/sighs

Lemme try this from another angle...

There is no dispute that US involvement -- tardy as it may have been -- was a pivotal turning point in the War.

There is, however, a dispute regarding the motives of the US at that time.

You apparently contend that the reasons were purely humanitarian -- I respect your sense of patriotism but damn, man... That's incredibly naive.

It was a tactical move fueled purely by self-interest. Nothing more and nothing less.

and you said countless people were slaughtered and tortured

Yes... Commonly refered to as "The Holocaust" -- Was there not a section about this on the site you gleaned all that 1812 stuff from? :p

um modern day Iraq? and no one gave a shit except the US

Modern day Iraq? Oh puh-lease!

Do you have any idea of how much crap like that goes on in most countries? It's ALWAYS been that way -- Human nature, ya know?

Yet nobody -- INCLUDING the US -- gives a shit about any of that unless they have something to gain (or lose) by getting involved.

You can't seriously be trying to tell me that you honestly believe Bush gives two shakes of a rat's ass about the Iraqi people or their plight... Are you?

Dude... The US has historically supported various dictatorships (many far worse than Saddam's) when it benefits them -- So has just about every other country. It's called politics and these decisions are based upon self-interest... All that emotional "free the people" bullshit is for the common folks.

You would be part of the united states of germany.

That would only be a valid argument if the US got involved for the sole reason of assisting us which, of course, was not the case.

Please try again...

Or, had we not been the border between mexico and you, you would be an off-branch of Mexico.

I don't have a reply to that -- I just thought I'd repeat it so anyone that missed it the first time could get a chuckle out of it too. :D

and you benefit us how? besides hiding behind america?

Hiding behind the US?

Riiiiight! Canada is known worldwide as a troublemaking non-nation that gets it jollies from picking fights with assorted countries and then sending their King/President/Prime Minister/Etc a nasty letter with the ominous PS:

And if you don't like it our good buddies to the South will nuke you. What aboot that, eh?

[chuckles]

You actually need me to list some benefits? Okies...

Electrical power supplied at token fees -- Far less than locals pay for it. Tell me, X... Would you recognize the benefit here if we cut the Hydro line tomorrow and plunged 3/4 of NY state into darkness for a few months?

Do ya think all the materials used for things like construction (wood, for example) in the US are procured locally? Are you under the impression that there's enough "US Grade A Beef" produced within the US of A to keep everyone fed adequately? Grains... Minerals... Even technology -- All of these are supplied to the States by us.

And in 50-100 years we'll likely be the only reliable source of fresh water for ya as well -- So be nice. :D

Partly, and heres why [SNIPPED copy&pasted explanation of how Canada was actually a French colony rather than a British one

Hold on a sec...

[breaks open his piggy bank and takes a look at some coins...]

Penny: Queen Elizabeth II
Nickel: Queen Elizabeth II
Dime: Queen Elizabeth II
Quarter: Queen Elizabeth II
Dollar: Queen Eli......

Odd -- One would think that a French colony would have some French monarch (past or present) here somewhere.

I suppose that the Queen -- Ya know? The mother of the guy with the ears? -- still being regarded by many as the Queen of Canada wouldn't serve to change your mind either, eh? :rolleyes:

However, in the case that America for some reason attacked Canada, and then the world came down on America, that would be the end for almost all countries, it is a domino effect.

The end? That's pretty drastic... Not to mention a bit of an exageration.

However none of what you said disputed the point I was making:

You were insinuating that Canada should be thankful for being allowed to exist because we are at the mercy of the US -- I simply pointed out (with a fair bit of eloquence, I might add) that this is not the case.

I wouldn't go that far. But i'd rather sound like one them then sound like one of the dickheads who support iraq.

Comments like that, X, are why most of the world considers Americans to be arrogant, self-righteous, ignorant boobs.

Consider for a moment that not everything you see on CNN is fact -- Then perhaps you'll be in a position to have a little perspective on issues.

Does Iraq hold beliefs that many North Americans would consider immoral? Yeppers.

Does North America hold beliefs that Iraq would consider immoral? Yeppers.

Tell me, X... What exactly is the difference between an Iraqi chanting "DIE AMERICAN SCUM!" and some redneck saying "KILL THE TOWELHEADS!"?

Artfully Yours,

Nnuk
Master of the Arts
Artful Death Gallery (http://www.artfuldeath.com)

PS As to evolving from monkeys?

or that lifeforms were misteriously on earth out of no where, oh wait they just came with the planet right? lol

For crying out loud.. Are you a friggin Creationist?!? :confused:

If so.. Please tell me now so I don't waste any further time trying to talk sanity and reason with ya.

[Note: For those of ya that don't know... A Creationist clings to the belief that the bible is kinda like a history book and meant to be taken literally. Like God created the world in a few days 5000 or so years ago, for example.]

[GrayRage]

There is no dispute that US involvement -- tardy as it may have been -- was a pivotal turning point in the War.

There is, however, a dispute regarding the motives of the US at that time.

You apparently contend that the reasons were purely humanitarian -- I respect your sense of patriotism but damn, man... That's incredibly naive.

It was a tactical move fueled purely by self-interest. Nothing more and nothing less.

I beg to differ. Although, our involvement WAS motivated to some extent by self interest, it was also perceived as a moral war where we were in the right. There were many slogans at the time which reflected as much. Additionally, the extent or even the existance of the Holocaust type activites was not really known by the outside world. The discoveries of the camps was a pretty big surprise.

There was a variety of reasons for our involvment, and one of them was to help the people of europe. Other reasons was cause Germany had allied with Japan who attacked us first.

Altho I disagree with some things Xondio said (about Canada), he is 100% correct about our what would have happened had we not gotten involved. 1 Million US men died in WW2....those 1 million men made the difference to be sure. It is doubtful Canada's involvement in the war would have made a difference as far as winnign or losing. No offense or anything.

My GrandFather was in WW2. From his stories he and his fellow soldiers believed it was a war vs. evil.

You can't seriously be trying to tell me that you honestly believe Bush gives two shakes of a rat's ass about the Iraqi people or their plight... Are you?

Dude... The US has historically supported various dictatorships (many far worse than Saddam's) when it benefits them -- So has just about every other country. It's called politics and these decisions are based upon self-interest... All that emotional "free the people" bullshit is for the common folks.

This is 100% true. But i don't care, I think he did what was good for us regardless of reasons. It was also good for israel. If we can turn Iraq and Afganistan into thriving democracies/capilstic contrries, it will hopefully spread.

There was ALOT of reasons for our involvement in Iraq.....and believe it or not...some of the reasons WAS to help it's people...but it was not the MAIN reason....and surely not the ONLY reason. It just so happens that what we did WILL help the people of Iraq.

Are you under the impression that there's enough "US Grade A Beef" produced within the US of A to keep everyone fed adequately?

Recently the US put a ban on Canadian beef because of the mad cow thingy there. Did you see how much that is costing the canadian economy? The US can purchase it's beef from US sources or elsewhere...the canadian beef industry, however, relies heavily on US consumption of that beef...or canadian ecomony will take a massive dive. Yes, the US is a BIG time consumer of products from around the world....and alot of that comes from Canada, but do not sonfuse our consumption of canada's products as a reliance. In fact OUR consumption of those products makes canada very much relly on US consuming them.

If the US stopp trade with Canada, what do you think would happen to Canada's economy? As much as I like our northern neighbor, it is silly to downplay their reliance on US....

It does not matter tho, cause when I am dictorator, your provinces will just become states anyhow.

And in 50-100 years we'll likely be the only reliable source of fresh water for ya as well -- So be nice.

This is silly cause we already have the technology to purify salt water :) The only reason we don;t do it is cause it's cheaper to take it from other sources. If we had too, tho, we have the oceans :)


You were insinuating that Canada should be thankful for being allowed to exist because we are at the mercy of the US -- I simply pointed out (with a fair bit of eloquence, I might add) that this is not the case.

Yar, but you are insinuating that Canada not does not need the US, but that we actually need canada....and I do not agree. His mention of the mexicans and us being in between simply implies that were we not here, Canada could very well be conquered by any number of hostile foes. It happens....look around the world....The uS makes it impossible for anyone to attack Canada.

Consider for a moment that not everything you see on CNN is fact

Yar, but everything on Fox News is fact, right? Or how bout the Jihad ahab network?

Tell me, X... What exactly is the difference between an Iraqi chanting "DIE AMERICAN SCUM!" and some redneck saying "KILL THE TOWELHEADS!"?

They have a national holiday where they get the day off to have parades and burn our flag and have hotdogs dreaming of killing americans? Close analogy tho!

I am a monkey still btw...only evolved a little.

[Xondio]

/sigh, i'll have to post a reply when I get the chance later tonight or tommorrow, i'm heading out :( (but ill throw a starter in there to warm up for my real post later tonight or tom)

I don't have a reply to that -- I just thought I'd repeat it so anyone that missed it the first time could get a chuckle out of it too.


Yeah, I think there are some more people who also find Canada amusing as well, thanks for the repost. :cool:

[Xondio]

Now your just wasting my time..
Originally posted by AD Nnuk
There is no dispute that US involvement -- tardy as it may have been -- was a pivotal turning point in the War.

There is, however, a dispute regarding the motives of the US at that time.

You apparently contend that the reasons were purely humanitarian -- I respect your sense of patriotism but damn, man... That's incredibly naive.

It was a tactical move fueled purely by self-interest. Nothing more and nothing less.



Right, you are completely right, why else would we want to stop a dictator from ruling the world? oh why do that when we can just start taking over France and Germany and make them pay us huge amounts of money after the war... oh wait, were the ones who helped pay to rebuild both countries, funny eh?



Yes... Commonly refered to as "The Holocaust" -- Was there not a section about this on the site you gleaned all that 1812 stuff from? :p

I couldn't tell if you were comprehending me, or knew anything about the war, since you said you won, which in fact you didn't, you won a skirmish or two, and lacked to mention Britain (thats like me saying we won our independence alone, which in fact the french helped.) was the force behind it, as well as we ended up winning anyway; so I instead decided to make a timeline out of the information I found off of different websites.



Modern day Iraq? Oh puh-lease!

Do you have any idea of how much crap like that goes on in most countries? It's ALWAYS been that way -- Human nature, ya know?

Holy shit really? wow I smell a hypocrit, from your last post you claimed the US stood by and let innocent people get slaughtered and tortured in WW2, but it's ok NOW because it's, "human nature".


Yet nobody -- INCLUDING the US -- gives a shit about any of that unless they have something to gain (or lose) by getting involved.

You can't seriously be trying to tell me that you honestly believe Bush gives two shakes of a rat's ass about the Iraqi people or their plight... Are you?


Because it was Bush's decision alone to start an entire war against Iraqi's. Of course he probably doesn't, nor do I. There are multiple reasons for it, here are just a few (I could make an entire post about each one but i'll keep it simple for now)

1) Saddam supported Al Queida's involvements, including 9/11.
2) Saddam *was* harboring WOMD (which most countries do, but we are talking about countries who don't use them frequently)
3) Chemical Ali (I would go into detail but it would be a post itself)
4) Saddam harbored terrorists.



Dude... The US has historically supported various dictatorships (many far worse than Saddam's) when it benefits them -- So has just about every other country. It's called politics and these decisions are based upon self-interest... All that emotional "free the people" bullshit is for the common folks.

Obviously no one believes they are there to free the people. But they are there to remove a threat. (I.E. Saddam supporting 9/11, harboring terrorists.)



That would only be a valid argument if the US got involved for the sole reason of assisting us which, of course, was not the case.

Please try again...

Why would we need assistance?

I'll make a quick reference to North Korea as well, they are obviously going to make WOMD, and yet US, China, Japan, and Russia are the only ones who are getting involved.



I don't have a reply to that -- I just thought I'd repeat it so anyone that missed it the first time could get a chuckle out of it too. :D

Yeah, I think most of us think Canada is a joke as well, thanks. :cool:



Hiding behind the US?

Riiiiight! Canada is known worldwide as a troublemaking non-nation that gets it jollies from picking fights with assorted countries and then sending their King/President/Prime Minister/Etc a nasty letter with the ominous PS:

And if you don't like it our good buddies to the South will nuke you. What aboot that, eh?

Canada doesn't pick fights for the sole reason they couldn't without getting laughed at.



You actually need me to list some benefits? Okies...

Electrical power supplied at token fees -- Far less than locals pay for it. Tell me, X... Would you recognize the benefit here if we cut the Hydro line tomorrow and plunged 3/4 of NY state into darkness for a few months?

Haha, first your mistaken that for TransEnergie, and believe me, it going down isn't the first time it's happened. Besides, NY has an ISO that is a 345 kilovolt undersea powerline... just in case you didn't know :cool:


Do ya think all the materials used for things like construction (wood, for example) in the US are procured locally? Are you under the impression that there's enough "US Grade A Beef" produced within the US of A to keep everyone fed adequately? Grains... Minerals... Even technology -- All of these are supplied to the States by us.

We could get it almost as cheaply as importing it. There isn't that much of a difference.


And in 50-100 years we'll likely be the only reliable source of fresh water for ya as well -- So be nice. :D

Read Gray's post on this. I can't believe you posted this, obviously there are ways to convert salt water into fresh water.


I suppose that the Queen -- Ya know? The mother of the guy with the ears? -- still being regarded by many as the Queen of Canada wouldn't serve to change your mind either, eh? :rolleyes:

.... i'll let that alone speak for itself.



However none of what you said disputed the point I was making:

Thanks, now lets go back and actually read my post.


You were insinuating that Canada should be thankful for being allowed to exist because we are at the mercy of the US -- I simply pointed out (with a fair bit of eloquence, I might add) that this is not the case.

I think you should be thankful, not merciful :D



Comments like that, X, are why most of the world considers Americans to be arrogant, self-righteous, ignorant boobs.

No, no, the world thinks were arrogant because they are jealous. Thats why were a super power and they are still third world countries :cool:

It's funny, a larger part of the world hates us and yet we don't give a shit, and yet maintain to support those same countries by giving them loans, funny world eh? I suppose the end is coming soon though, when countries like North Korea (hates America) decides to try to attack us, and then we rip them a new one, and then rense, repeat.


Consider for a moment that not everything you see on CNN is fact -- Then perhaps you'll be in a position to have a little perspective on issues.

Oh I forgot God, please enlighten me since you know everything. Perhaps you will have a perspective on these issues when you don't buy into third world country propaganda.


Does Iraq hold beliefs that many North Americans would consider immoral? Yeppers.

Does North America hold beliefs that Iraq would consider immoral? Yeppers.


Such as, Americans don't believe in strapping bombs to themselves and declaring Jihad and killing *innocent* people.

Or, our governments NOT training terrorists camps on how to do this.


Tell me, X... What exactly is the difference between an Iraqi chanting "DIE AMERICAN SCUM!" and some redneck saying "KILL THE TOWELHEADS!"?


The difference, the redneck saying kill the towelheads doesn't hijack two planes and crash them into a couple of towers killing thousands of innocent people.

And a redneck doesn't strap bombs to themselves, once again declaring jihad while killing innocent people including children... keep trying i'm sure you'll learn.


For crying out loud.. Are you a friggin Creationist?!? :confused:

If so.. Please tell me now so I don't waste any further time trying to talk sanity and reason with ya.

I'm just making fun of the fact that you think lifeforms could have formed on a desolate rock... and then somehow transformed into the complex Human Being.



[Note: For those of ya that don't know... A Creationist clings to the belief that the bible is kinda like a history book and meant to be taken literally. Like God created the world in a few days 5000 or so years ago, for example.]

[Note: For those of you who don't know... An evolutionist clings to the belief that we formed from the simpleton monkey.]

[AD Nnuk]

I beg to differ.

/nods

I figured you'd have been chomping at the bit several posts ago. ;)

Although, our involvement WAS motivated to some extent by self interest

Some extent? I dunno. To me the whole...

cause Germany had allied with Japan who attacked us first.

... Deal sounds more like the primary motivator.

he is 100% correct about our what would have happened had we not gotten involved. 1 Million US men died in WW2....those 1 million men made the difference to be sure.

I cannot for the life of me understand why you folks insist upon arguing that point with me -- Where the bloody Hell did I say they didn't?

They were "the pivotal turning point" because they -- along with the rest of us -- comprised a force sufficient to take care of business.

It is doubtful Canada's involvement in the war would have made a difference as far as winnign or losing. No offense or anything.

None taken.

Canada -- a country of 12 million people -- put over 1 million citizens into uniform during WWII. That's almost 10%.

Canadian war factories were safe from bombing so, naturally, Canada became an arsenal and was Britain's chief overseas supplier of war materiel.

Canada did not accept American Lend-Lease aid. Actually Canada ran its own lend-lease program for its allies called "Mutual Aid", supplying its allies with four billion dollars worth of war material. A further credit of a billion dollars was given to Britain.

In WWII Canadian soldiers were among the first ground troops to fight the Japanese, in Hong Kong. As part of the defending force, two thousand Canadians, in two battalions, held out on Hong Kong Island against impossible odds for 17 days.

The Dieppe Raid in 1942 was the first large scale attack on Hitler's Fortress Europe -- it was essentially a test of the German defenses -- and it was Canadian troops who made up 85% of the force.

On D-Day, 14,000 Canadians stormed ashore on Juno Beach and were the only force to capture all their initial objectives that day, at a cost of 1000 casualties, of which 350 were fatal.

The liberation of Holland was almost entirely a Canadian operation.

In 1943 Canada took over naval control of the north-west Atlantic, and by war's end, 80% of the convoys across the North Atlantic were protected by Canadian escort vessels.

Throughout the war, Canada provided training facilities and instruction to airmen from all over the world in the British Commonwealth Air Training Plan, graduating 132,000 pilots and aircrew, over half of whom were Canadian -- U.S. president F.D. Roosevelt called Canada "the aerodrome of democracy".

This whole cut&pasting business sure makes this easier. [chuckles]

All flag waving aside:

No single country won WWII -- It was a global conflict in which all the participants played key roles.

My GrandFather was in WW2. From his stories he and his fellow soldiers believed it was a war vs. evil.

I don't doubt it for an instant.

I never said the troops were there out of self-interest -- I said their leaders decision to wade into the conflict was.

This is 100% true. But i don't care, I think he did what was good for us regardless of reasons.

The reasons which the above quote dismisses as inconsequential are, in fact, what this entire line of conversation is about.

Also worthy of note is that I don't believe I've said whether I thought it was good or not yet. ;)

Recently the US put a ban on Canadian beef because of the mad cow thingy there.

Considering that the cow -- the one, single, solitary cow -- involved originally came from the States and more than apropriate measures were taken to stifle any possibility of spreading... I'd say that ban had more to do with other trade disputes we've been having.

But that's neither here nor there... Please go on.

Did you see how much that is costing the canadian economy?

Not really... That's more of a problem out West than in my neck of the woods -- Kinda like an earthquake in LA doesn't really affect some dude in NY.

If the US stopp trade with Canada, what do you think would happen to Canada's economy?

More than likely it would take an extremely heavy hit -- Quite possibly plunging Canada into a recession/depression period potentially lasting in the decades.

But the US isn't going to stop trade with Canada because it's always beneficial for them as well.

Just as it would be ridiculous to downplay the importance that trade with the US has for Canada... It would be downright laughable to argue that Canada/US trade is essentially a welfare program offered to the North by their benevolent Southern neighbor.

It does not matter tho, cause when I am dictorator, your provinces will just become states anyhow.

Fine with me -- Lower taxes, an environment which encourages free enterprise and the like are not things I'd automatically refuse. :cool:

This is silly cause we already have the technology to purify salt water

Have you ever tasted that stuff, man? It's even worse than American beer -- Like a cross between flat coke and horse piss.

[opens his trenchcoat to reveal several vials of cool, crisp, clear fresh water]

Come on, Gray... You know you want the good stuff! :D

Yar, but you are insinuating that Canada not does not need the US, but that we actually need canada

Nopers.

I'm flat out stating that neither needs the other to survive but life is a lot more pleasant for both due to the friendly relationship we've enjoyed over most of our time on this continent together.

His mention of the mexicans and us being in between simply implies that were we not here, Canada could very well be conquered by any number of hostile foes.

I understood his implication... I'm still chuckling about it, actually. :p

If we really wanna get theorethical I suppose I could put forth the argument that -- were it not for the existence of the USA -- Canada could very well have 300+ million citizens spanning down to the Southern border with Mexico.

[shrugs]

It's all a bunch of poppycock -- The bottom line is that the US presence does indeed serve as a deterrent for most (I say "most" because it also serves to makes us targets for "some") potential attacks upon Canadian soil and, of course, we'd much rather have you as a friend than an enemy. But, again, I firmly believe that any official "bodyguard" actions taken would be done solely for self-interest so let's not expect any gushing gratitude. ;)

Yar, but everything on Fox News is fact, right? Or how bout the Jihad ahab network?

Nope.

All of the "news" is presented in a certain light depending upon the target market -- It is a business, after all, so British news will have a Brit slant and French news will have a French slant.

I just mention CNN in particular because they rank about as high as the National Enquirer and Iraq's ex-Information Minister in terms of credibility with me ever since I watched them crow about the effectiveness of Patriots as a defense against SCUDs back when Daddy Bush was doing his stint in Kuwait -- even supplying footage and commentary pointing out strikes -- only to find out a few years later that there hadn't yet been a single confirmed kill and the whole "100% effective" thing was nothing but a friggin glorified infomercial.

But I digress.. My point to X was simply that there is a little concept called "perspective" and that accepting one particular version of events like this as Gospel is a sure fire way to be wrong.

They have a national holiday where they get the day off to have parades and burn our flag and have hotdogs dreaming of killing americans?

Doesn't everyone? :p

Lemme ask ya, Gray... If you were from Iraq and the only side of the US you've ever been exposed to was images of riots in LA, KKK rallies, Manson/Dahmer/Etc, people swarming women & staff near abortion clinics, perceived interference in what you consider to be local/religious issues -- Why the Hell wouldn't you wish to kill some of the opressive bastards?

It's every bit as understandable as a fellow from the States who's only impression of Iraq was gleaned from Desert Storm/Liberation SomethingOrAnother coverage and footage of a relative few fanatics holding parades having the impression that it's citizens are zealots and need of a good bombing.

Understandable... Yet narrowsighted and, by consequence, erroneous.

As for you, X... I'm pretty much out of time so you're gonna get a short comment tonight.

wow I smell a hypocrit, from your last post you claimed the US stood by and let innocent people get slaughtered and tortured in WW2, but it's ok NOW because it's, "human nature".

What, precisely, is hypocritical about it?

Did I say it wasn't ok when the US does it? Did I say it was ok because it was human nature?

Nope.

What I did say -- and still do, for that matter -- was that your portrayal of the WWII-era USA happens to be a fantasy. I'm not condemning them for their actions... I'm calling you naive for not seeing them.

That's true for just about everything in this thread, actually. Despite what you seem to think I'm not disputing any of the FACTS you've presented -- I am simply removing the sugar-coating.

Perhaps tomorrow I'll go over your post a little more carefully and give it a thorough reply -- Assuming there's something present worth replying to.

G'Night, folks.

Nnuk <== And on the 7th day he rested
Master of the Arts
Artful Death Gallery (http://www.artfuldeath.com)

[Eyepatch]

seriously you guys WTF you think too much. concentrate on more important stuff like these drawringz!!! (http://pdiddles.homestead.com/files/Media/MOTHER~1.jpg)

[GrayRage]

I just mention CNN in particular because they rank about as high as the National Enquirer and Iraq's ex-Information Minister in terms of credibility with me ever since I watched them crow about the effectiveness of Patriots as a defense against SCUDs back when Daddy Bush was doing his stint in Kuwait -- even supplying footage and commentary pointing out strikes -- only to find out a few years later that there hadn't yet been a single confirmed kill and the whole "100% effective" thing was nothing but a friggin glorified infomercial.

Just so you know, CNN is very much "anti-Bush" and virtually a voice for the democratic party whilst Fox News seems to be the opposite. So anything on CCN about Bush and company (dad or son) will either be true or stinted in the negative ;p

If you were from Iraq and the only side of the US you've ever been exposed to was images of riots in LA, KKK rallies, Manson/Dahmer/Etc, people swarming women & staff near abortion clinics, perceived interference in what you consider to be local/religious issues -- Why the Hell wouldn't you wish to kill some of the opressive bastards?

I doubt seriously a person who has zero freedom of religion, zero freedom of speech...and basically zero personal freedoms....is to concerned about us being "oppressed" ;p They prolly look at our LA riots and say "Damn, if we did that, Saddam would just nerve gas us to death (which, BTW, woulda' been a great idea for the LA riots), they got it good over there!"

[Xondio]

You're constantly mistaking the so-called "sugar-coating" for actual facts. But your almost there. I'm hoping you go back thoroughly through my post and actually read this one.









Xondio <=== and on the 7th day, he evolved from a monkey who evolved on a desolate planet.

[AD Nnuk]

Just so you know, CNN is very much "anti-Bush" and virtually a voice for the democratic party whilst Fox News seems to be the opposite.

/nods

As I mentioned earlier... The "news" is a business and, as such, the people/companies involved tend to present their reports in a manner which appeals to the consumers in their niche of the market -- Democrat (Left) and Republican (Right) in the case of American politics.

So anything on CCN about Bush and company (dad or son) will either be true or stinted in the negative ;p

Under normal circumstances... Yes indeed.

But CNN (a company marketing a product) isn't run by idiots. They remembered quite clearly that Desert Storm was their finest hour and they are more than smart enough to know that many people who wouldn't normally even consider flipping their TV onto CNN would be doing precisely that -- Why would they go through the time, effort and expense of setting up shit like embedded reporters and the like only to make anti-Bush reports?

No.. What they did was switch from a "Left vs Right" slant to a "USA vs Iraq" one for the duration of the conflict.

There's nothing wrong with this, of course, and I am not admonishing them for it -- My disdain for the bastards stems from elsewhere. ;)

I doubt seriously a person who has zero freedom of religion, zero freedom of speech...and basically zero personal freedoms....is to concerned about us being "oppressed" ;p

Things are rarely so black & white, Gray.

Was Saddam a ruthless dictator? Sure thing.

But man... We're talking about civilazations which have lived similarly for thousands of years longer than there's been caucasians in North America.

Who are we to smugly tell them that they are wrong and must live by our standards from now on?

Freedom of religion? Sheesh -- A guy's family has been Muslim for over 2000 years... Leave 'em the Hell alone, for pete's sake!

Freedom of speech? This ideal doesn't work everywhere. We're setup to handle it in North America -- Throwing it into the mix in societies like the Middle East, China, etc would be one Hell of a mistake.

Kinda like PvP in EQ (in the sense of something meant to be good thrown into an environment not designed to support it) on a global scale. :p

Artfully Yours,

Nnuk
Master of the Arts
Artful Death Gallery (http://www.artfuldeath.com)

[Hamadryad]

I'm pissed Nnuk didn't join in when I was discussing Canada's vs US involvement in WW2 like, 6 months ago on the DB EQ board

And I'm pissed Dave and Lisa visited canada without telling me!

-Hamadryad

[Xondio]

Here we go again Nnuk.


Things are rarely so black & white, Gray.

Was Saddam a ruthless dictator? Sure thing.

But man... We're talking about civilazations which have lived similarly for thousands of years longer than there's been caucasians in North America.

Who are we to smugly tell them that they are wrong and must live by our standards from now on?

Freedom of religion? Sheesh -- A guy's family has been Muslim for over 2000 years... Leave 'em the Hell alone, for pete's sake!


We are telling them it's ok not to support terrorist regimes. We are telling them it isn't ok to go into Kuwait and kill, excuse me, slaughter over 4,000 men,women, and children.

Again, this is why you are hypocritical. You said we let thousands and thousands of innocent people get tortured and slaughtered because we *stood by*. Yet in this post, you're saying, "sure it may be wrong, but cmon man they've lived like that for so long, leave them to torture and slaughter innocent people.".

I suppose I'll never get through to you though, oh well. ;)

[AD Nnuk]

Hammy is pissed about something(s)?

/gasp

How shocking! :p

Xondio... Oh Xondio...

I've explained this 6 ways from Thursday but, for some incomprehensible reason, you're simply not grasping the point.

Please understand that, while I do enjoy a good verbal joust on occasion, it does get a little frustrating to come up with different ways to explain to someone why the square peg won't fit in the round hole.

/shrugs

Perhaps we'll tangle some other time, eh? We can go over a few things like how dinosaurs and dragons weren't the same thing and neither of 'em walked the Earth with man a few thousand years ago. :rolleyes:

Artfully Yours,

Nnuk
Master of the Arts
Artful Death Gallery (http://www.artfuldeath.com)

[Xondio]

Lol, maybe we will tangle again when you go back and actually read half of my posts :D .


How about...

Battlefield 1942 > MOH:AA ??

[Exodus]

agreed!

oh and eyepatch:

Originally posted by eyepatch
seriously you guys WTF you think too much. concentrate on more important stuff like these drawringz!!! (http://pdiddles.homestead.com/files/Media/MOTHER~1.jpg)

All i have to say is lol. simply lol.

[Xondio]

Oh and by the way, I voted before that we change french fries to traitor tots but that didn't have as much following as I had hoped :( :(

[AD Nnuk]

"French Fries" originated in Belgium.

[Xondio]

You're missing the point genious :(


Which you most often seem to do apparently.


With my last post unargued I take it you gave up on comprehension, so since you seem to still want to post here, go back and read my last post concerning the French, come up with a valid arguement for everything I have said and not just parts of it.. considering you still come back here.

Don't you have somewhere more important to be, such as some political Canada propaganda convention, handing out fliers of how Canada was the actually the "real" force behind WW2? :(

[AD Nnuk]

With my last post unargued I take it you gave up on comprehension blah blah blah

Not quite, pipsqueak.

Upon reading about your scholastic test (Congratulations on doing well, btw) it occured to me that I was essentially arguing with a combination of ignorance and the self-righteousness of youth.

So rather than continue trying to come up with different ways to explain this shit to you... I opted to give you a nice, cozy, face-saving way out of the verbal trouncing your bible-thumping ass was receiving.

You seriously want replies to each and every individual "point" (for lack of a better term) you made? Shit on toast...

And a redneck doesn't strap bombs to themselves, once again declaring jihad while killing innocent people including children...

No... They load up their pick-up with a ton of fertilizer and park it in front of government buildings. You're from Oklahoma and I have to tell you this?

They also have a tendency to gun-down/terrorize doctors, nurses and patients in abortion clinics while declaring "Jihad". Read newspapers much?

And that was your "best" argument in the post, junior, so it'll also be the only one I'll bother responding to.

Except for this...

keep trying i'm sure you'll learn

Don't try to pull the superiority act with me, kid -- I bloody originated it back before you figured out how to jack off.

Now... If you're half as smart as you like to think you are, whelp, you'll recognize my voluntary removal from this thread as the act of generosity that it was and move on to something else.

G'Day.

Artfully Yours,

Nnuk
Master of the Arts
Artful Death Gallery (http://www.artfuldeath.com)

[Xondio]

Hold on there. Your grasping at your last straws apparently using Timothy McVey. In all socialiable conciousness I can't allow you to continue if you're going to try and liberate to me the terms of the Oklahoma city bombing to the death of over 2000 human beings in the World Trade Center. There is a massive difference, yet you continually dwell on a pea for a gun to defend yourself, try again.

Unfortunately, you have also subscribed to the propaganda of third-world countries. It really does amuse me to read posts though.

As for me being young, yes, I must confess I enjoy my youth at the age of 20. The college life is great I admit. While you are jealous and are slowly decaying at the age of 57 :D , I realize that you must have prescribed medication and it tends to change the thought process. It's ok though, I completely understand that you have envy of my youth. So while I'm sitting here at college, partying and much more, you'll be sitting in your chair nude while masturbating to the Olsen twins and thinking of the 15 year old next door. :p


Thanks,
Xondio.

[AD Nnuk]

Can't "allow" me to continue? LOL I'd like to see ya stop me, sparky. ;-)

Here's another example of your ongoing problem here...

liberate to me the terms of the Oklahoma city bombing to the death of over 2000 human beings in the World Trade Center.

Where's the quote of me doing that?

There isn't one, lad.

I'm equating ole Timmy with your rendition of the Jihad-screaming Iraqi with bombs strapped to his carcass because, like it or not, there is precious little difference between 'em.

Why don't you try something before your next post, okies?

Rather than spew your repetitive drivel and continually say how little I understood of your comments... It might serve you well to take a deep breath and actually grasp mine before you make an ass out of yourself.

Again.

Artfully Yours,

Nnuk
Master of the Arts
Artful Death Gallery (http://www.artfuldeath.com)

PS Creationism.Org (http://www.creationism.org/) :rolleyes:

[Xondio]

/sigh

I don't need to make you stop, because you're kicking your own ass :(

Again here we go... You're comparing one man who blew up a building to hundreds of muslims who strap bombs to themselves and blow each other up. Thats like me saying every Muslim is a terrorist because one person is. You're comparing one 'Timmy' to hundreds of Muslims who strap bombs to themselves...I'm getting tired of equating the same story in different ways for you :(


PS: Evolutionism (http://www.mindspring.com/~kenwear/evolcrea.htm) ;)

[AD Nnuk]

... I'm getting a headache. :-(

Thats like me saying every Muslim is a terrorist because one person is.

For the love of... That WAS your point, man!

The whole *@&@^!*(@ reason I had to bring up Tim was to illustrate to you that one man (or one fanatical segment) is not representative of an entire population... And now you're trying to enlighten me with my own goddamned point? Are you out of your cotton-pickin' mind?

Somebody shoot me... Please.

Artfully Yours,

Nnuk
Master of the Arts
Artful Death Gallery (http://www.artfuldeath.com)

ps Evolution is a fact; there’s no denying that.

Well.. It is; And there isn't. :p

[Xondio]

Lol. No, I'm pointing out the fact that you can't compare one 'timmy' to hundreds of crazy muslims running around blowing up innocent people.

[Exodus]

Lol this is such a great thread! Im checking the General forum daily to read this bullshit! When(if actually) you guys stop arguing about terrorists and other bullshit you should move onto who owned who in EQ if you guys ever fought eachother, that would be great!!!

PS Xondio that avatar you have is still making me laugh! Would you happen to have a link to that video with sound maybe?

[Xondio]

you know me, of course i do!


http://www.fdntech.com/torrents/Star_Wars_Kid.wmv.torrent


and the remix (you have to watch both, watch the first link one first though, its so funny)

http://www.fdntech.com/torrents/Star_Wars_Kid_Remix.wmv.torrent

oh, and a reloaded one too

http://www.fdntech.com/torrents/Star_Wars_Kid_-_Reloaded.wmv.torrent